I am sure that all of the power companies will do their best to get power restored as quickly as possible. I cannot believe how stupid some people are to sue Pepco for the superstorm in July. It was an act of nature. Nature is more powerful than all of us. Pepco should always ensure the safety of their workers first.

PEPCO should ensure the safety of its workers and the public! However PEPCO does not seem concerned with the safety issues of the devices it puts on our homes that are emitting rf radiation at much higher levels then they admit. THEy are a Class 2 B carcinogen with more evidence coming in daily about the toxic health effects. I hope none of you have your bed in a room near a Smartmeter because you are getting toxic full body exposure!
here is an unbiased site that puts the peer reviewed studies online as they come in daily from scientists around the world. Check it out !
http://www.emf-portal.de/
You may understand why opting out is so important very soon.

This Storm could also be damaging in terms of powersurges to these meters that in the past has been implicated in a series of house fires.

typical PEPCO cop out.

FIREs and Overheating Smartmeters!
http://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news/local/Home-Scorched-by-PECO-Smart-Meter-Fire-Officials-168972086.html

Smartmeters a Health concern?
Read this report about the emissions they give off 24 hours a day pulsed constantly!
http://www.bioinitiative.org/freeaccess/report/docs/report.pdf

I have a new smart meter and have had no problems or ill effects from it
that I am aware of. PEPCO never asked if I wanted one or not they installed
them for everyone on our street!

You actually have a choice to opt out now. Many of the possible health effects are long term ones with radio frequency radiation. Did you read about the fires?

If you are interested in possible health effects check out this document that the public health officer of Santa Cruz County delivered http://www.scribd.com/doc/99701545/Santa-Cruz-Health-Services-Health-Risks-Associated-with-SmartMeters

Dear PEPCO - when I don't work, I don't get paid. All I ask is that you don't charge me a delivery fee if you don't actually deliver electricity. Sounds reasonable, doesn't it? And gives you incentive to start delivering electricity faster, doesn't it?

Dearest Malaprop,
So glad you are back to throw in your Telecom funded responses about Smartmeters!
I love how you hop around all over the Nation on Patch attacking and bullying anyone who brings up the large body of science showing that the pulses from Smartmeters have serious biological health impacts that the utility companies are minimizing.
Anyone who thinks that PEPCO or the utiity companies care about our health need to spend a little time educating themselves on the research that is out there and the fact that the pulses are a WHO reviwed Class 2 B carcinogen due to EMF's link to brain tumors. Furthurmore, research continues to come out showing negative effects from EMF fields.
Malaprop seems to be an industry funded person online who comments all over in an attempt to squash the public's concerns. I simply cannot imagine that he lives in so many areas of the country? strange... time to get a new name Malaprop.

MaryJane:

You thought Hirsch's work was valid. You can't read a research paper. Who are you fooling?

All you do is post what you find on the anti-smart meter sites. You know nothing.

Again, more bullying from Malaprop. You cannot discount thousands of studies that show that the radiation from EMF's impacts your health. keep trying by refusing to read or name calling. Have you read the WHO report. try reading all 500 or so pages not just the summaries! lol

just try i know it might be hard for you. I hope the Telecom and utilitiy companies are paying you by the hour.

As was stated earlier...
If a stranger comes to your door wanting to come in and be with your children. You do not know him but many neighbors have reported he has hurt their children... Some have not..
At what point do you decide not to let him in?
How many neighbors does it take?

For me, with kids, it would be prudent to be safe.

That is why I continue to call you out. For safety's sake!
If you have children or grandchildren that you love then you simply must know what I am talking about.
If you do not have children then I doubt you could ever understand.
I do all my research on the EMF portal. Go there and check it out. I challenge you Malaprop to talk about brain premeability and more. The evidence is there . It is you and your employer who try and cover it up best as you can by ridicule and ignorance.

I await your thoughts on all the studies I have sent. So far, you have little to say.
It is not hard to understand injured sperm, damaged spindles, brain barrier leaks or poor memory Malaprop.
Can you understand this?
Can you read the studies?

Lets go to the entire body of research Malaprop.
ants, plants and people.
I challenge you, go to it and lets talk.

Even pediatricians The AAP ! say cell phone standards need another look and to take precautions.. http://healthland.time.com/2012/07/20/pediatricians-call-on-the-fcc-to-reconsider-cell-phone-radiation-standards/

Malaprop
There is an avalanche of research coming to you and your Telecom Utility Comany funded propaganda.....
be ready for it.
Anyone who gets the info makes the educated choice.
Anyone who cares about our grandchildren's future which clearly you do not!

You cannot even keep up with my comments.

You mean this study?
British Journal of Cancer (2010) 103, 1128–1135.
Pooled analysis of recent studies on magnetic fields and childhood leukaemia
L Kheifets, A Ahlbom, C M Crespi, G Draper, J Hagihara, R M Lowenthal, G Mezei, S Oksuzyan, J Schüz, J Swanson, A Tittarelli, M Vinceti and V Wunsch Filho

Background: Previous pooled analyses have reported an association between magnetic fields and childhood leukaemia. We present a pooled analysis based on primary data from studies on residential magnetic fields and childhood leukaemia published after 2000

Results: In the combined results, risk increased with increase in exposure, but the estimates were imprecise. The odds ratios for exposure categories of 0.1–0.2 μT, 0.2–0.3 μT and 0.3 μT, compared with <0.1 μT, were 1.07 (95% CI 0.81–1.41), 1.16

Conclusions: Our results are in line with previous pooled analyses showing an association between magnetic fields and childhood leukaemia. Overall, the association is weaker in the most recently conducted studies, but these studies are small and lack methodological improvements needed to resolve the apparent association. We conclude that recent studies on magnetic fields and childhood leukaemia do not alter the previous assessment that magnetic fields are possibly carcinogenic.

It has everything to do with Smartmeters which is why YOU Malaprop need an education!
ELF EMF is the electromagnetic radiation from powerlines and electrical appliances and the utility companies worked pretty hard to minimize those risk years ago. Thankfully for them the increased childhood leukemia cases were small enough that they have been able to get away with it. Of course now that neurodegeneration is linked to it, things are a changing but thats another story that will play out in time as more research comes in.
The point is that with Smartmeters which emit EMF as well but at the radio frequency/microwave level- once again the utlity companies are saying this is safe and once again the WHO and IARC are finding it is a CLASS 2B carcinogen because of associations with increased cancer risk.
With me so far Malaprop?

The difference is ..... Smartmeters will be on all our homes!
not everyone lives near powerlines MALAPROP .
so hmmmm a bit more of a public health issue dont you think!

All the researchers involved started out doing the ELF work of course.. so you cant talk about one without the other, Furthurmore RF reserach is in its infancy while there is a large body of work on ELF (more needed to be done but the association with childhood cancer is clear as day and NO ONE disputes IT!)
GOT it?
understand the issues here?
Whats your ethical stance on that?

Am J Epidemiol. 2008 Nov 5. [Epub ahead of print]
Residence Near Power Lines and Mortality From Neurodegenerative Diseases: Longitudinal Study of the Swiss Population.
Huss A, Spoerri A, Egger M, Röösli M; for the Swiss National Cohort Study.

The relation between residential magnetic field exposure from power lines and mortality from neurodegenerative conditions was analyzed among 4.7 million persons of the Swiss National Cohort (linking mortality and census data), covering the period 2000-2005. Cox proportional hazard models were used to analyze the relation of living in the proximity of 220-380 kV power lines and the risk of death from neurodegenerative diseases, with adjustment for a range of potential confounders. Overall, the adjusted hazard ratio for Alzheimer's disease in persons living within 50 m of a 220-380 kV power line was 1.24 (95% confidence interval (CI): 0.80, 1.92) compared with persons who lived at a distance of 600 m or more. There was a dose-response relation with respect to years of residence in the immediate vicinity of power lines and Alzheimer's disease: Persons living at least 5 years within 50 m had an adjusted hazard ratio of 1.51 (95% CI: 0.91, 2.51), increasing to 1.78 (95% CI: 1.07, 2.96) with at least 10 years and to 2.00 (95% CI: 1.21, 3.33) with at least 15 years. The pattern was similar for senile dementia.

Whooops 4.7 million people?
really?
darn thats pretty bad...
and the saddest thing is that prior research that utility companies continued to downplay spoke of these risks!
I could send you those links if you would like.....
EMF is linked to neurodegeneration. They postulate it causes a buildup of a neurotoxin in the brain.
darn!
too bad it took years to get to that point! why?
because it was not tested first. Because when these effects were seen, the utility companies did their best to squash it, to bully and do just as you are paid to do Malaprop.

sad for those living under a powerline is all I can say!

Why the CLASS 2 B carcinogen rating for ELF EMF exposure above 3 mG
"...... This classification was based on pooled analyses of epidemiological studies demonstrating a consistent pattern of a two-fold increase in childhood leukaemia associated with average exposure to residential power-frequency magnetic field above 0.3 to 0.4 µT. The Task Group concluded that additional studies since then do not alter the status of this classification."

MaryJane:

You criticized Lerchl -- you are excellent at name calling -- but you failed to address the very simple calculation he disputes. You run away from any discussion of the studies you post.

You seem to do little other than post studies from activist sites and then run away from any serious discussion. It's obvious you do not read any of these -- your interest in discussion is nothing but a bluff.

Your digression from the flaws in the studies you present notwithstanding ELF is not the same as RF.

Furthermore the data on ELF is inconclusive. Special interest groups have been lobbying for research and of course fat fees for lawyers, but the studies remain in dispute.

Why would you want an analog meter if you are concerned with ELF?

If you wish to discuss studies, Lerchl's calculations would be an excellent starting point. They are extremely simple so it should be easy for refute them if they are wrong.

Why do you continue to run away?

Dear Malaprop,
Running away is not in my repertoire.
I do believe that I have sent you an overwhelming amount of research and perhaps you are swimming in it. I ask that you read it.
There is at this point an overwhelming amount of data with findings that suggest we have a lot to be concerned about with Radio frequency radiation.
Do you dispute all of it?
Remember..with ELF EMF.." This classification was based on pooled analyses of epidemiological studies demonstrating a consistent pattern of a two-fold increase in childhood leukaemia associated with average exposure to residential power-frequency magnetic field above 0.3 to 0.4 µT. The Task Group concluded that additional studies since then do not alter the status of this classification."

And with Radio frequency radiation
Lyon, France, May 31, 2011 — The WHO/International Agency for Research on Cancer (IARC) has classified radiofrequency electromagnetic fields as possibly carcinogenic to humans (Group 2B), based on an increased risk for glioma, a malignant type of brain cancer, associated with wireless phone use.

“Given the potential consequences for public health of this classification and findings,” said IARC Director Christopher Wild, “it is important that additional research be conducted into the long- term, heavy use of mobile phones. Pending the availability of such information, it is important to take pragmatic measures to reduce exposure such as hands-free devices or texting. ”

So in terms of Smartmeters.. shouldn't we take the same pragmatic measures? and not stick them on every house considering....
Makes sense to me..
Malaprop, do you dispute the concerns of the IARC or WHO? Do you have issues with numbers that they contemplated?

http://smartmeterhelp.com/HealthSymptoms.cfm

It seems that 5%-10% of the populations may immediately experience mild to severe symptoms within days of the SmartMeter installations.

List of Common Symptoms:

Sleep Problems: Sleep disorders are the most common symptom reported. This includes insomnia or the inability to go into deep sleep. Many people report that their sleep problems began the night the SmartMeters were installed in their neighborhood.

Headaches: Many people experience mild to severe headaches when they are in the presence of SmartMeters. Mn ay people have reported that as soon as they left their home on vacation, their headaches vanish. But upon returning to their home or SmartMeter installed area, the headaches come back immediately.

Ringing in the ears

Confusion or difficulty concentrating
Fatigue

Increased stress and agitation

Heart palpitations

Tingling sensations thought the body

Difficulty breathing or heaviness in the chest and lungs

There are many other symptoms that have been reported, but the above list are the most common. If you are experiencing any of these symptoms, you should see if their onset began around the same time SmartMeters were installed in your area.

http://smartmeterhelp.com/HealthSymptoms.cfm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sKDX_UGaZaU&playnext=1&list=PLA089695ACD52E0C2&feature=results_main

"Neurosurgeons like Keith Black in Los Angeles said: "What microwave radiation does in most simplistic terms is similar to what happens to food in microwaves, essentially cooking the brain" and Charlie Teo in Australia said, "There is an increasing body of evidence that there is an association between brain tumors and mobile phones."
http://microwavenews.com/news-center/iarc-cell-phone-radiation-possible-human-carcinogen

As I stated " Running away is not in my repertoire".
You on the other hand have been given an ocean of data and when asked to discuss it cannot come up with anything to say.

If the IARC has concerns about emissions, the same emissions that Smartmeters emit, what we are looking at is enough studies that have data that suggests a possible connection to cancer.
That's a fact Malaprop.
Honestly, I look to the experts. I do not pick apart each study. It would be one thing if there were one study showing a connection to cancer and I was holding it up , waving it high..
but no.. what we see here are thousands of studies.....

so please go to http://www.emf-portal.de/ and start readiing or just go to the WHO or IARC reports.

Remember to read the entire document!
yikes.
I cannot imagine any of those folks hold a cell phone to their ear, or sleep with their heads next to the Smartmeter on the opposite side of the wall or live under a high voltage powerline for that matter.
Unless they are complete idiots.
In fact they recommend folks take precautions like text or use headsets!
Can you read Malaprop?
Try it.
in black and white it exists.

American Academy of Pediatrics- President Dr. Robert Block told Time Healthland, “Children, however, are not little adults and are disproportionately impacted by all environmental exposures, including cell phone radiation. In fact, according to [the International Agency for Research on Cancer], when used by children, the average RF energy deposition is two times higher in the brain and 10 times higher in the bone marrow of the skull, compared with mobile phone use by adults.”
http://www.prweb.com/releases/cell-phone-radiation/lawyer/prweb9730706.htm

Dr. Jerome Paulson, chair of the AAP’s council on environmental health and a pediatrician at Children’s National Medical Center in Washington, D.C.
recommends doing what comes naturally to many kids: text. That way the cell phone isn’t near a child’s head. For phone conversations, use a hands-free device. And pregnant women, take care not to carry your cell phone in a pocket near your abdomen.

OK that makes sense when studies areshowing possible issues....
So in terms of Smartmeters lets do the same thing that makes sense!
Keep them away from your head!
Keep them away from children.

Should we really deploy them?? How about useing a wire to connect them and avoid all these potential quite serious possible risks!
How stupid are we?
Not to take precautionary measures.
Really?

Smartmeters are microwaves: Much experimental evidence of non-thermal influences of microwave radiation on living systems has been
published in the scientific literature during the last 30 years – relating both to in vitro and in vivo studies – and
were reviewed just recently by the STOA commission of the European Parliament (STOA 2001). From the use
of microwave wireless technologies e.g. the following non-thermal biological effects have been reported:
!" Changes in the electrical activity in the human brain,
!" Increase in DNA single and double strand breaks from HF exposure to 2.45 GHz,
!" Increased lymphoma rates (2 fold) in transgenic mice exposed twice a day exposed to 30 minutes of
cell phone (GSM) signals over 18 month,
!" Increased permeability of the blood-brain barrier in rats,
!" Observation of an increase in resting blood pressure during exposure,
!" Increased permeability of the erythrocyte membrane,
!" Effects on brain electrochemistry (calcium efflux),
!" Increase of chromosome aberrations and micronuclei in human blood lymphocytes,
!" Synergistic effects with cancer promoting and certain psychoactive drugs,
!" Depression of chicken immune systems,
!" Increase in chicken embryo mortality,
!" Effects on brain dopamine/opiate electrochemistry,
!" Increases in DNA single and double strand breaks in rat brain,
!" Stressful effects in healthy and tumor bearing mice,
!" Neurogenetic effects and micronuclei formation in peritoneal macrophage.

Malaprop,
You exist? Great.. and can you believe that each of these effects corresponds to specific groups of research studies? Sigh, Im starting to get bored with your inability to do anything but name call or lower yourself to acting like an online bully.
Sigh. I think I have sent you far to many to manage already.Yikes, it is a lot....
Lets try to be adults here.
In fact there are more lists I could send to you.
I await your thoughts on Ethics....

Oh I was just reading this....

http://www.winlab.rutgers.edu/~gruteser/papers/fp023-roufPS.pdf
A team was able to easily hack into smartmeter data and determine if folks were home for 500 meters worth. sigh....
“I consider it an embarrassment that this kind of technology is deployed with no protection whatsoever,” says Klaus Kursawe, a security researcher at Radboud University Nijmegen in the Netherlands, who was not involved in the work. “It is well known by now how to properly and economically secure communication for such a device.”
Be warned folks...not just smart criminals looking to see if you are on vacation but a whole host of hacking can be done with these handy meters in the wrong hands.

http://marylandsmartmeterawareness.org/smart-meter-news/newscientist-wireless-smart-meters-tell-snoopers-when-you-are-not-home/

Still not as important as the radiation ......but thought you might be interested dear Malaprop.

had to cut and paste this again..
“the International Agency for Research on Cancer (IARC) classified radiofrequency radiation as a 2B, possible human carcinogen“

why? increased brain tumors!

The National Cancer Institute issued a statement that “children may be at greater risk of health effects than adults because their nervous systems are still developing at the time of exposure.”Duration of cell phone use and ipsilateral use (using the same side of the head) increase health risks.
total cut and paste from a great site
http://www.centerforsaferwireless.org/Cell-Phones-and-Children41.php

Malaprop,
Did you cut and paste this from the comment you made last month?
It is you who continue to avoid all that i have sent you.
LOL I certainly have no connection to the Holocaust denyers although I cant help but wonder what your connections are. Especially as I have family who were killed by Nazi's.
but that is another story and perhaps why I am so adamant about this issue.
What does it mean that PePcO and the utility companies and Telecom continue to deny these serious health issues?
Where are the ethics here?
What I do know is that you are trying desperatly to cover up the wealth of research that exists. i have half a mind to cut and paste (my new favorite term) the European commissions review of EMF to remind you of the issues.
you are unable to respond to it and all that i send and yawn.. end up just sending more of the same.
if you are bored I am more bored but somehow look forward to your antics.
Keeps me researching more.
and what a nice platform....

Smartmeters = Radiation on your wall
a nice easy to read article for you Malaprop
"Given the potential consequences for public health of this classification and findings, it is important that additional research be conducted into the long-term, heavy use of mobile phones," IARC Director Christopher Wild said in a statement. "Pending the availability of such information, it is important to take pragmatic measures to reduce exposure such as hands?free devices or texting."
http://news.cnet.com/8301-30686_3-20067593-266.html

"Some experts have interpreted the results to suggest that people who use a cell phone for at least an hour each day over a 10-year period are at an increased risk of developing some brain tumors. This research, these experts argue, also suggests that these tumors are more likely to be on the side of the head where the phone is most often used."

WHO issued a report based on the findings of a team of of 31 scientists from 14 countries, including the United States, who considered peer-reviewed studies about the safety of cell phones. The team said that it had found enough evidence from the studies it examined to consider exposure to cell phone radiation as "possibly carcinogenic to humans."

This is all I need to take precautions for my family. Malaprop why are you so adamant that this is not enough. How much are they paying you for your mal icious prop aganda. ?

I certainly would never compare you or your utility or Telecom friends to Hitler or the atrocities they committed .....best to stay away from this area with me .... but I almost considered comparing you to the Holocaust denyers you yourself brought up- in terms of the clear ignorance and lack of respect for walking in this world with integrity and care for others.
There is something else going on with you that you should go on in a website in this way. You clearly have another agenda. and ethics is a word you probably steer away from like the plague.

You brought up WW 2 Malaprop- not me.
Look, I do not know her story or how this happened. I am willing to spend my time researching health issues but not to investigate this any furthur because my time is valuable.

I will say this issue brings together folks I might otherwise never associate with.

What i do know is that CEOs who are making millions when not being truthful about the health issues related to their devices are acting without ethics, without integrity.
That I know.
why are you trying to discount the thousands of scientific studies that show concerning effects from EMF?

All I want is a hard wire connecting these meters. at that point .... I am willing to stop making such a fuss... but putting in pulsed radiation into our homes... noooooo makes no sense..
i have nothing worth stealing in my home anyway.

Again...
WHO issued a report based on the findings of a team of of 31 scientists from 14 countries, including the United States, who considered peer-reviewed studies about the safety of cell phones. The team said that it had found enough evidence from the studies it examined to consider exposure to cell phone radiation as "possibly carcinogenic to humans."

"You brought up WW 2 Malaprop- not me."

Where??? More fiction from you.

You cloud Holocaust Denial with the atrocities. These are distinct phenomena and it is wholly inappropriate to bring in the latter.

There is no question that Hoch appeared on the show of a Holocaust Denier and she is not the only anti-smart meter activist to do so. Apparently it's a rite of passage.

As far as overpaid CEOs I leave that to the shareholders and PSC. Are the CEOs greedy? Absolutely -- what else is new? Have your way with them.

The flaw in your logic is that their bloated salaries existed long before smart meters.

My peeve is that anti-scientists such Sage, Carpenter, Johansson and receive praise instead of contempt and activists who appear on Holocaust Denial talk shows are lauded instead of shunned.

So much for ethics.

Smartmeter Radio Frequency Radiation is the same type of radiation that cell phones emit.
So again Again...
WHO issued a report based on the findings of a team of of 31 scientists from 14 countries, including the United States, who considered peer-reviewed studies about the safety of cell phones. The team said that it had found enough evidence from the studies it examined to consider exposure to cell phone radiation as "possibly carcinogenic to humans."

What do you say to this?
All agree- no independent studies have even been done on Smartmeters specifically. How smart is that when other studies on the same emission show increases in brain cancer.

ohh and you brought up the Spingola talk show Holocaust denyer issue, not me..

That would be a World War 2 matter of course.

Speaking of Wars, in my awareness raising I have found some of the most support from Veterans. They are all talking to me about Agent Orange and how long it took for the government to recognize its effects and others spoke about working on submarines and immediately knowing how the wiring in Smartmeters is just poor and a set up for fires.
I have to tell you that me and these guys connected immediately on the matter of Smartmeters. They deeply understood how the companies might try and cover up negative effects.
They have no tolerance for Propaganda. been there done that..
totally inspiring they were .

Perhaps I should get one of them here to talk to you about propaganda and cover ups. hmm Tomorrow.

The SMART GRID system is nothing more than a system of accelerated energy costs with accompanying tax increases. The system cannot and does not deliver more efficient use of energy and isn’t meant to. The intent of the GRID and the meters is to pin energy rates to the ever fluctuating markets enabling the energy provider to charge the highest rate possible in any given period of time.
from an anti Hitler site

MaryJane:

Any chance you are going to discuss the Yale-mice study and Lerchl's calculations?

I would prefer this to discussing your ambivalence to Holocaust Deniers.

Malaprop,
I sent you what encapsulates hundreds of studies. Do you think the WHO got it wrong?

Malaprop,
A pig is a pig - be it fried or in a sausage.
LOL "the WHO said nothing about Smartmeters?"

Now you are truley showing your true colors.
that is like saying that the report tested lead from chewing paint...and it was dangerous.. but we should not worry about the lead in contaminated fruits.. http://www.foodsafetynews.com/2012/11/imported-dried-fruits-recalled-for-high-lead-levels/

Lead is lead
Radio frequency radiation is radio frequency radiation no matter what device it comes out of Dear Malaprop.

I think you are finding it hard to respond to facts at this point.
I am not a statistician although I did ace those classes a long long lonnnnng time ago. I would have to leave it up to the experts in the field. not a telecom funded guy kicked off the panel for conflict of interst. Get my point Malaprop. .
The experts in the field who state.
So again ..
WHO issued a report based on the findings of a team of of 31 scientists from 14 countries, including the United States, who considered peer-reviewed studies about the safety of cell phones. The team said that it had found enough evidence from the studies it examined to consider exposure to cell phone radiation as "possibly carcinogenic to humans."

Malaprop,
sooo are you saying that reports showing health effects from cell phone radiation are not important is discussing Smartmeters?
Let us be clear here. Is this a point you wish to make?

Indeed I do- Frank!

Lets drop the World War Two discussion before you two get in over your heads.
I am sure these Smartmeters are well tested.

You all are ignorant not to see a cover up when there is one.
Those Utility Companies are not gonna let out information if they can help it. I am proud to have served my country but dirt like this I know all too well.
Just like I'm fighting to get insurance coverage for my situation and these companies are stalling stalling stalling I am sure these companies are doing the same.
Smells like MONEY to me.

http://www.public.navy.mil/navsafecen/Pages/acquisition/radio_frequency-radiation.aspx

http://www.osha.gov/SLTC/radiofrequencyradiation/index.html

Radiofrequency and Microwave Radiation page

Matt, the levels of RF are much less in Smartmeters then emitted by those transmitters on the ships ..but RF Radiation indeed.

It's ;ike this....
there is just way too many doctors writing about this issue, researching it.
If it were not an issue I do not think folks would be spending their valuable time writing articles like this.
"Firefighters have increased exposure to RFR in the course of their work, from the mobile two-way radio communications devices which they routinely use while fighting fires, and at times from firehouse and fire vehicle radio transmitters. I suggest that some of the increased cancer risk in firefighters is caused by RFR exposure, and is therefore preventable. The precautionary principle should be applied to reduce the risk of cancer in firefighters, and workman's compensation rules will necessarily need to be modified."

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19464814

And George, no,
no long term independent studies on the health effects of Smartmeters on the public have been done!
However we can look at RF EMF studies to draw thoughtful conclusions.(unless you are Malaprop who thinks adding sugar to lead makes it "candy", not "suger coated lead" ") What we get are... some effects, increased brain tumors at the highest , longest use.. needs more research..
its good enough for me to take pause.
And ask questions.

and Ill just cut and paste this... (dont sqeal too loud Malaprop)
but please note, the impact on immune function is an emerging concern in EMF research and one that greatly concerns me in terms of it's far reaching implications.

From the use
of microwave wireless technologies e.g. the following non-thermal biological effects have been reported:
!" Changes in the electrical activity in the human brain,
!" Increase in DNA single and double strand breaks from HF exposure to 2.45 GHz,
!" Increased lymphoma rates (2 fold) in transgenic mice exposed twice a day exposed to 30 minutes of
cell phone (GSM) signals over 18 month,
!" Increased permeability of the blood-brain barrier in rats,
!" Observation of an increase in resting blood pressure during exposure,
!" Increased permeability of the erythrocyte membrane,
!" Effects on brain electrochemistry (calcium efflux),
!" Increase of chromosome aberrations and micronuclei in human blood lymphocytes,
!" Synergistic effects with cancer promoting and certain psychoactive drugs,
!" Depression of chicken immune systems,
!" Increase in chicken embryo mortality,
!" Effects on brain dopamine/opiate electrochemistry,
!" Increases in DNA single and double strand breaks in rat brain,
!" Stressful effects in healthy and tumor bearing mice,
!" Neurogenetic effects and micronuclei formation in peritoneal macrophage.

I still have my old meter. I might have to bolt it to my wall.

$@$@#@ like this pisses me off.

"the city recently settled lawsuits by 10,000 WTC workers, more than 600 of whom have developed cancer.

But officials have so far insisted there is no scientific proof that Ground Zero smoke and dust caused cancer."
They insisted and insisted but they knew! no scientific proof? You know what those towers were made of?

http://www.veteranstoday.com/2011/04/04/911-nuke-demolition-proof-firefighters-radiation-cancers-off-the-scale/
a shining example of ignorance

http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/subjects/s/sept_11_2001/health_and_environmental_issues/index.html

These guys should not have had to fight for this!

Cancer?
Watch this excellent video detailing the issues with non thermal effects of Radio Frequency Microwave Radiation.
It is Dr. Davis talking about RF radiation after being introduced by the head of the National Institute of Environmental Health Sciences

http://ehtrust.org/dr-davis-speaks-at-the-national-institute-of-environmental-health-sciences/

Want to go see experts speak?
In DC! EXPERT FORUM: Cell phone radiation, pregnancy and sperm: what you don’t know, what you need to find out, and what you can do now
Where: National Press Club

Murrow Room

529 14th Street NW

Washington, DC

When: November 12, 2012

9-11 am

http://ehtrust.org/expert-forum-cell-phone-radiation/

Malaprop,
Hugh Taylor from Yale will be there and perhaps you could go attend and ask the questions you so desire to ask.

Want to meet there Malaprop?
Is a "prop" osition....

CNN's Sanjay Gupta talks to Hala Gorani about the effects of cell phone radiation on your brain. September 26, 2012

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/health/2012/09/26/idesk-gupta-cell-phone-radiation-standards.cnn

MJ:

If you do not know statistics, especially the calculation of a mean, then you are not fit to judge the quality of studies that you cut-and-paste from alarmist sites.

So what exactly are you doing?

MJ:

"I would have to leave it up to the experts in the field."

Really, like Daniel Hirsch, Lecturer on Social Policy? Yes you promoted his work.

Or the mouse study where we don't know how much, if any RF exposure, the little ADHD mice received? The study with flawed calculations which you do not understand?

To you, someone is an expert if they are an alarmist -- you are incapable of judging quality.

MJ:

Can you tell me of you know the difference between the exposure of a cell phone held against the head vs. that of a smart meter?

Even if you think the difference in exposure is a trick of the Telecom/Utility cabal, do you understand what is behind it?

We would like to know if you understand this simple concept.

MJ

According to you:

"If it were not an issue I do not think folks would be spending their valuable time writing articles like this."
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19464814

Now you know where else the author of this study spends his time -- that's right on the Holocaust Denial talk show. You quote such honorable, reliable scientists:

http://www.spingola.com/July2012.html
"Wednesday, 7/25: Dr. Samuel Milham, author of Dirty Electricity; Occupational Mortality Database"

You are absolutely pathetic. You know nothing, which you finally admitted above.

Cut-and-paste alarmist studies -- all you can do.

Dear Malaprop,
oh my. Isn't that ironic!
I would say you have me there! as I surely would not have posted that!
You have me there. Sheesh.
It seems to me that folks are getting so little coverage they need to get alliance where they can.
I mean look , we can go to town on folks connections to right wing extremist hate groups. the KK and such.. Is this really the discussion you want to have?
hmmm could be interesting
I will say there is a faction of folks in it for the privacy issue . I do not want o get political here because my point is about health.
I know what I know.
Even if we did disregard this guys article there is still so much more so here is the deal.
If you think it's all rubbish, how about you take all the studies and discredit them one by one. So far Ive sent you at least twenty links.. oh dear maybe more.. and of course all the WHO and IARC reports.
Start there Malaprop.

Do you think the docs on the WHO panel are connected to Spingola?

In fact,,,, it would place bets on finding some Utility Company money going in places they would much rather conceal.

So Malaprop,
TUT TUT
get to it. I sent you so much. Should I cut and paste more?
Still my offer stands. Lets meet at that talk and we can ask the author himself about those mice. We also should fully vet the guy for connections to right or left wing extremists. - now that you are so politically thoughtful ..... and so filled with integrity that you refuse to elaborate on.

And I do want your thoughts on this one about ELF.
m J Epidemiol. 2008 Nov 5. [Epub ahead of print]
Residence Near Power Lines and Mortality From Neurodegenerative Diseases: Longitudinal Study of the Swiss Population.
Huss A, Spoerri A, Egger M, Röösli M; for the Swiss National Cohort Study.

The relation between residential magnetic field exposure from power lines and mortality from neurodegenerative conditions was analyzed among 4.7 million persons of the Swiss National Cohort (linking mortality and census data), covering the period 2000-2005. Cox proportional hazard models were used to analyze the relation of living in the proximity of 220-380 kV power lines and the risk of death from neurodegenerative diseases, with adjustment for a range of potential confounders. Overall, the adjusted hazard ratio for Alzheimer's disease in persons living within 50 m of a 220-380 kV power line was 1.24 (95% confidence interval (CI): 0.80, 1.92) compared with persons who lived at a distance of 600 m or more. There was a dose-response relation with respect to years of residence in the immediate vicinity of power lines and Alzheimer's disease: Persons living at least 5 years within 50 m had an adjusted hazard ratio of 1.51 (95% CI: 0.91, 2.51), increasing to 1.78 (95% CI: 1.07, 2.96) with at least 10 years and to 2.00 (95% CI: 1.21, 3.33) with at least 15 years. The pattern was similar for senile dementia.

Why is this Huss study important? (MKalaprop, please check that he is not on any hate sites because seriously that would be terrible! )
Why is it important? to look at EMF studies.. Because years ago they were only looking at cancer and it was considered "alarmist" to discuss it ..... now twenty years later research on neurodegeneration is coming up...
If we disregard what we know so far which is enough for the World scientific powers that be to issue a statement, well then who is to say that in twenty years after doing to longitudinal studies that take time and money.. that we will not see more devasting illness linked to RF Radiation..
We need to look back and consider this.
Or are we just doomed to repeat history again as we did with Lead and asbestos and cigarettes,
Anyone listening knows this.

Our country allies itself with powers that commit atrocities every day MaryJane.
And its all about MONEY and POWER.
I'm almost tempted to meet you there as I work downtown.

FYI, I do not believe for a minute Malaprop is a real person with real thoughts. Don't waste your time.

oh Dear i just could not help myself.
Former CEO of U.S. Telecommunications Company Sentenced to 46 Months in Prison for Bribing Foreign Government Officials
http://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/2011/September/11-crm-1155.html
Executive Sentenced to 15 Years in Prison for Scheme to Bribe Officials at State-Owned Telecommunications Company in Haiti
A list of Telecom criminals
http://www.technology.am/tech-ceos-who-were-jailed-062326.html
http://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/2011/October/11-crm-1407.html
http://www.lightreading.com/document.asp?doc_id=221803

Im sorry but this is disgusting
"Executive bonuses would take up about one fourth of a new rate hike request filed by the largest natural gas distribution company in Kansas.

Kansas Gas Services’ request to increase rates by $32 million a year would include about $8 million in executive bonuses."
http://salinapost.com/2012/10/23/executive-bonuses-account-for-14-of-kansas-gas-service-rate-hike-request/

LOL
It's about the Crime in Science!

Malaprop,
Shall we talk about the Science and Crime of cigarettes or asbestos or lead ?
You can't seriously be so naive.
OK fine of course you are not. You are just doing your best to discredit anything I say.
It falls short. You should have taken debate class in elementary school

"Please explain the relevance of this."
I just know you can do better Malaprop.

It is criminal.
"At 1/100th of FCC guidelines: sleep disorders, abnormal blood pressure, nervousness, weakness, fatigue, limb pain, joint pain, digestive problems, learning problems (fewer schoolchildren promoted). At 1/1000th of FCC guidelines: altered EEG, disturbed carbohydrate metabolism, enlarged adrenals, altered adrenal hormone levels. structural changes in liver, spleen, testes, and brain, slowing of the heart, increase in melatonin, decreased cell growth, increased sterility, childhood leukemia, impaired motor function, reaction time, memory and attention of school children, and altered sex ratio of children (fewer boys); cardiac arrythmias and sometimes cardiac arrest (frogs); altered white blood cell activity in schoolchildren, headache, dizziness, irritability, fatigue, weakness, insomnia, chest pain, difficulty breathing, indigestion (humans - occupational exposure); 1% of FCC guideline: damaged mitochondria, nucleus of cells in hippocampus of brain, impaired memory and visual reaction time, redistribution of metals in the lungs, brain, heart, liver, kidney, muscles, spleen, bones, skin, blood. (5)
Please note: RF radiation impacts plants, animals, and humans. Plant growth can be interfered with."
http://www.smartmeterdangers.org/index.php/smart-meter-questions-answers

I think the impact of plant growth is quite stunning. I do believe I sent you links to some of those studies a while ago. It explains the death of shrubbery around banks of Smartmeters. D you remember this Malaprap?

Malaprop,
You do not know who you are talking to and I can guarantee you that the only fool in this room is a person with a fake name who clearly has another agenda.
- Matt

I have read your posts. You got nothing to add and you AVOID the science.
Money and POWER Man!

Malaprop,
You said, ":Please understand that your service, much appreciated, will not make any difference if you tag along with the propaganda that Mary Jane is so eager to have you present."
I think this was a mistake and to say that someones service does not count because of their stated views is quite erroneous and frankly I am speechless that you should even say such a thing.

You said:
Matt T.

1) Thank you for your service to our country.

2) You comments here are not particularly helpful and it would be sad to see someone who distinguished himself in military service speak foolishly about science. Please understand that your service, much appreciated, will not make any difference if you tag along with the propaganda that Mary Jane is so eager to have you present.

I think an apology is in order Malaprop.

Malaprop,
You are treading water at this point. Be careful when you speak like that. I have looked into this issue of Smartmeters and I am not impressed.
Plenty of doctors and physicists are concerned, so I am too. George

In fact here is a Professor of Physics with a wealth on infirmation. Hold your breathe because I am sure Malaprop will call them names and give expletives as to why they are radical extremists or something like this.

Dr. Henshaw
http://www.electric-fields.bris.ac.uk/HREG_front.htm

Malaprop. Everytime I name a scientist concerned about EMF's you call them "alarmist" or something along those lines.

http://www.sfexaminer.com/local/2011/10/sf-cellphone-radiation-label-debate-reaches-courtroom
talk about trying to suppress information!

Mary Jane, go away and stop spamming every thread that mentions Pepco with your crap.

http://smartmeterhelp.com/HealthSymptoms.cfm

It seems that 5%-10% of the populations may immediately experience mild to severe symptoms within days of the SmartMeter installations.

List of Common Symptoms:

Sleep Problems: Sleep disorders are the most common symptom reported. This includes insomnia or the inability to go into deep sleep. Many people report that their sleep problems began the night the SmartMeters were installed in their neighborhood.

Headaches: Many people experience mild to severe headaches when they are in the presence of SmartMeters. Mn ay people have reported that as soon as they left their home on vacation, their headaches vanish. But upon returning to their home or SmartMeter installed area, the headaches come back immediately.

Ringing in the ears

Confusion or difficulty concentrating
Fatigue

Increased stress and agitation

Heart palpitations

Tingling sensations thought the body

Difficulty breathing or heaviness in the chest and lungs

There are many other symptoms that have been reported, but the above list are the most common. If you are experiencing any of these symptoms, you should see if their onset began around the same time SmartMeters were installed in your area.

http://smartmeterhelp.com/HealthSymptoms.cfm

Is there any evidence that current meters cause harm? If not, I might request keeping mine. It's not so much that I think Smart Meters are harmful because I haven't seen good evidence to that effect. Nevertheless, I'm not sure I need it based on the "benefits" declared by Pepco on their FAQ page: http://www.pepco.com/energy/blueprint/smetersmd/faq.aspx. The benefit to consumers would seem to be fewer trucks on the road for meter readers, but this seems to be a pretty small benefit. For me, ultimately, the minimal benefits are probably outweighed by the minimal chance of health issues. To each their own.

Not only are Smart meters emitting a Class 2 B carcinogen that have a slew of other associated health effects of extreme concern.. but research shows that Smartmeters do not save the consumer anything, nor does it save energy as it is purported to do.http://www.consumersdigest.com/special-reports/why-smart-meters-might-be-a-dumb-idea

In case you did not see it before ( and this is for you Teresa since you did not get a chance to read the other comments about science).
The WHO and the International Agency for Research of Cancer have stated this because of the increase in glioma and acoustic neuroma brain tumors in those with highest cumulative use.
http://www.iarc.fr/en/media-centre/pr/2010/pdfs/pr200_E.pdf

Smartmeters emit this radio frequency non ionizing radiation.
It is important to note that independent studies show that these meters emit more pulses then the utility companies state they do and in addition are sometimes installed in ways that violate FCC regulations.
Other studies are showing this radiation could be impacting bees predisposing them to colony collapse, impacting plant growth and impacting the immune systems of living things these pulses move thruogh.
Educate yourself with real science and do not simply swallow the company Koolaid. It is unfortunate you have to dig hard to get real facts. In fact Telecom and the utilities actively try and block this information from getting out as in the case of San Francisco.

Good Luck to you all.

You might want to read this letter by physician David O. Carpenter, former founding dean of the University at Albany (NY)’s School of Public Health about the possible health effects of Smartmeters.
http://maisonsaine.ca/smart-meters-correcting-the-gross-misinformation/

Dr. David Carpenter has been caught on YouTube demanding proof of no effect. This is something that science cannot do -- proof of the negative.

Now why would a scientist demand something science cannot do. The obvious and correct answer is that Dr. David Carpenter, Harvard degree and all, has taken the role of Internet pundit and not that of a scientist.

The letter is laughable. It is not written for people who understand science. It is addressed to drones like MaryJane who do not understand science(*) and who can be counted upon to retransmit to like-minded activists.

I've posted detailed complaints about Carpenter's letter elsewhere. The gist is that Carpenter quotes several dubious sources. This includes the incompetent Santa Cruz Health Officer who bases her complaint in large part on Daniel Hirsch who is a lecturer on social policy.

The other objectionable study in Carpenter's letter is the Sage Smart Meter report whose flaws were meticulously documented in an EPRI report.

Sage and Carpenter make no attempt to convince the scientific community --their targets are the anti-wireless movement, lawyers, politicians and anyone else who furthers their enterprise.

Thank you Malaprop for your work on this. I expected it. EPRI is the utility Company's experts who are paid to mimize lawsuits against the utility companies. There is nothing laughable about the letter except that you and your buddies who put it down become speechless when faced with the facts. LOL

How about this great article about the former directer of the DC PSC whose bills were double from a Smartmeter utility company screw up.. ... http://www.wmal.com/Article.asp?id=2547189

According to its 2001 annual report, EPRI members include almost 1,000 energy producers as members; 27 of its 30-member Board of Directors represent utility companies. (EPRI Annual Report 2001, http://www.epri.com/corporate/discover_epri/epri_facts/EPRIAnnualRpt_01.pdf;

Let's look at one very, very simple criticism from the EPRI report.

http://www.marbleheadelectric.com/EPRI_SageReport.pdf

This is basic physics and requires hardly any knowledge of EM fields.

"The FCC states that to characterize a person’s exposure properly, the RF power density should be averaged across the entire volume of an exposed body. An example in the EPRI Report indicates that power density averaged over the body of a 6-foot person situated one foot in front of a meter is less than approximately one-quarter of the emission at the point of the wavefront’s peak at that distance. The Sage Report assumes a uniform field across the body that is equal to the peak power density within a body’s cross-section, thus overestimating an individual’s exposure."

Do you understand what EPRI says here -- even if you disagree?

Can you back up your endless, tiresome rhetoric with some science?

I gave you the links to IARC and to the WHO. Start there.

Malaprop, while I am in the medical field I am not a statistician. I read what the doctors put forward, not! the utility companies. I'm too old to fall for that.
talk to me about increased brain glucose use or studies like these .. http://www.emf-portal.de/viewer.php?aid=16986&l=e
Albumin extravasation was statistically significant increased in the mobile phone exposed rats as compared to sham exposed controls after this 7-day recovery period at the SAR value of 12 mW/kg and with a trend of enhanced albumin extravasation also at the SAR values of 0.12 mW/kg and 120 mW/kg. There was a low, but significant correlation between the exposure level (SAR-value) and occurrence of focal albumin extravasation.
The data are in agreement with earlier studies of the authors (see above and "related articles") where they have seen increased permeability of blood-brain barrier immediately and 14 days after exposure.

Here is how Sage responded to the EPRI report:

"EPRI did not present calculations using the FCC OET Bulletin 65 equations that are fundamental to predicting RF levels. Thus, no apples-to-apples comparison can be made from their selective presentation of examples of RF levels. EPRI gave none of the basic information needed to check their figures. They provided no comprehensive assessment using the same FCC OET 65 equations, nor the range of possible duty cycles or reflection factors, nor specifying what power output, gain, effective radiated power (ERP) or other critical factors were used in their selected examples."

Let's look at the game Sage plays here. Sage states that EPRI did not present calculations. That is true -- they did not. What EPRI did is criticize the numbers that Sage used in the calculations.

So what Sage effectively says that EPRI does not claim that the calculations are wrong -- e.g. the spreadsheet is not making a mistake. EPRI claims the data used in the spreadsheet (or whatever tool Sage uses) are wrong. Sage is cleverly trying to deflect and hide the substance of the EPRI report with the most twisted logic.

This is fodder for people like you MJ who cannot catch the subtle logic.

Do you get it? Can you refute what I'm saying? I very much doubt it.

Remember, Sage has a fear driven consulting practice.

Here is another tidbit from Sage's response to the EPRI report:

"Absent from EPRI’s comment is an acknowledgement of the FCC’s own requirement to use a 100% duty cycle where the public cannot be excluded. This is specifically discussed in the Sage Report on pages 22 -23 and 31-36."

Now this is truly fascinating -- the FCC sent a response to Sage on this very matter:

"Since the purpose of these devices is to provide very infrequent information they transit in occasional bursts. Thus, for exposure purposes the relevant power is maximum time-averaged power that takes into account the burst nature of transmission, and based on the maximum time-average transmitter power for many of these devices, the would generally be compliant with the SAR limit even if held directly against the body."

Sage's attempt to arrogate watchdog status of standards fails miserably among those who understand the issues.

But it works for you and that's pretty much the limit about what Sage cares. Sage knows there is no way to fool the educated.

It get worse MJ.

I'll have more later about this deception against which you offer no relevant information.

You have no defense other than complaining about EPRI and its alleged conflict of interest.

What about Sage's conflict?

Remember, Sage (along with Carpenter) is an editor of the BioInitiative report.

Yes and everyone should read the Bioinitiative Report
http://www.bioinitiative.org/report/bioinitiative-report/

Wondering about your iphone?
Go here http://ehtrust.org/cell-phone-fine-print-warnings/

The data demonstrate that fetal exposure to 800-1900 MHz from cellular phones leads to behavioral and neurophysiological alterations that persist into adulthood. Further experiments are needed to determine the risk of exposure during pregnancy.

http://www.emf-portal.de/viewer.php?aid=20377&l=e

or for a list of studies related to cognition issues go here http://www.emf-portal.de/overview/children_mb.php?l=e&explode=2&view=1&tab=2#alle

"look at what happened with cigarettes"

Yes, look what happened. Reputable scientists conducted quality research. That is what should be done here. They did not need rhetoric and platitudes from pundits like Sage and Carpenter whose work I have laid bare above.

"You have a choice to opt out of this device on your home that has brought so much controversy."

Yes you do. One alternative is a smart meter and the other an analog meter with extra fees. So if you want to pay PEPCO more listen to Mary Jane, because pay more is the only thing know-nothing wants you to do.

Malaprop do you work with PEPCO? I have asked you before if you are paid by the post or word and you never answered?

Is it fair to charge a person with a pace-maker or medical implant an opt out fee?

Louis Donovan of Carson, CA relies on both a cardiac pacemaker and a defibrillator to keep him alive. In this video, he tells of his experience of EMR from his smart meter stopping his heart 4 times.

With the untested, unthinking installation of smart meters worldwide, people everywhere with common medical equipment such as pacemakers, defibrillators, and many other devices are actually being forced to directly contravene the strict usage guidelines (to stay out of EM fields). This is costing an untold numbers of human lives.
Video interview: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BRDhogkdxW4&list=UUklG6ilxW_PeYeDSpKSRGZQ

Also fyi: Vermont has no opt-out fee. The ACLU of Vermont has argued that the entire program should be an opt-in program. Should a a person be forced to pay to keep something off of their own home that is unhealthy.

Malaprop and the industry that he/she defends know the meters are unsafe, unhealthy and collecting second by second personal data. The industry in turn sells this Data and turns it over to the police.

The Supreme Court recently ruled that placing GPS devices on cars without a warrant was unconstitutional. How is this any different?

May 6, 2011 Resolution passed by the Council of Europe. http://assembly.coe.int/Documents/WorkingDocs/Doc11/EDOC12608.pdf

The Council of Europe Resolution bemoans the fact that earlier calls for the use of the precautionary principle in relation to exposure to EMF (such as the 2008 resolution cited above) have been ignored and that children and young people, in particular, are being exposed to increasing levels of EMF. The children and young people are described as a “particularly vulnerable group.”

"After analysing the scientific studies available to date, and also following the hearings for expert
opinions organised in the context of the Committee on the Environment, Agriculture and Local and Regional
Affairs, there is sufficient evidence of potentially harmful effects of electromagnetic fields on fauna, flora and
human health to react and to guard against potentially serious environmental and health hazards"

Really, heck.. Ill pay extra money not to have this on my house.. it is extortion!
and Ill fight it
but right now Im standing up to pure stupidity

More text if you are too busy to click on the link
"Lastly, the Assembly could endorse the analyses and warnings issued first in September 2007, then in
September 2009, by the European Environment Agency (EEA) concerning the health hazards of
electromagnetic fields, mobile telephony and not least mobile phones. According to the EEA, there are
sufficient signs or levels of scientific evidence of harmful biological effects to invoke the application of the
precautionary principle and of effective, urgent preventive measures"

The Council of Europe (French: Conseil de l'Europe) is an international organization promoting co-operation between all countries of Europe in the areas of legal standards, human rights, democratic development, the rule of law and cultural co-operation. It was founded in 1949, has 47 member states with some 800 million citizens, and is an entirely separate body[1] from the European Union

Malaprop- you said, "The "Council of Europe?"Why not get Lindsay Lohan's opinion as well?"
That says a lot about your level of education and perhaps your tiresome comments are now put into perspective.

Lohan has enough troubles without you dragging her into this!

Another quote from this document
"Scientific studies concerning the negative effects of certain microwave frequencies on plants, insects and wildlife or farm animals are disturbing in more than one respect, and the scientific studies disclosing
Doc. 12608
10potentially pathogenic biological effects on the human body are also important and not to be merely brushed
aside."

Malaprop, your job is to brush them aside but thankfully others are able to see past your company cover up --although I doubt Lohan would....

Spinach and Smartmeters!
Oh no
"The scientists selected the two types of plants and raised them by providing nutrients, water and temperature under laboratory conditions. These plants were exposed by EMWE of frequency 900 Mega hertz and field strength 1.9 milli tesla for 72 hours.
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/vadodara/Cellphones-ring-in-death-knell-for-plants-Study/articleshow/16715290.cms?intenttarget=no

The scientists carried out both physiological and biochemical analysis of these plants.

They noticed that morphological changes like decrease in growth rate in terms of height, number of branches and leaves is seen in such plants. Their leaf size gets decreased, leaves become more brittle and they fell off early.

"The biochemical tests indicated that after exposure there is a decrease in assimilatory pigments like chlorophylls and anthocyanins which shows decrease in photosynthetic rate in plants. At the same time, the carotenoid pigment content increased which resulted in the aging effect," director of Junagadh-based Noble Group of Institutions Ved Vyas Dwivedi said."

Three of those signing Carpenter's letter, Belyaev, Hardell and Szmigielski sat on the IARC committee who issued the infamous May 11 decree. How any real scientist could sign Carpenter's pseudoscience (which includes references to Santa Cruz and Daniel Hirsch) escapes me. These are not stupid people.

I would love to see if any of those three would dare defend Sage's smart meter report that was also referenced in the paper. That would be absolutely precious.

Dear Malaprop, If what you are saying is that the IARC and WHO are corrupt then we are really screwed!
But thank you for pointing out that members of the IARC signed this letter as it gives it even more authority in my book.

Can you vet this group too. They are the scientific advisory group for Dr. Darvis. Did any of them serve on the IARC? or WHO?
http://ehtrust.org/about/scientific-advisory-group/

MaryJane:

Time to take you to task. Let's see if you run away again.

1) Present your refutation to the very simple Lerchl calculations.

2) Respond to Sage vs. EPRI.

Dear Malaprop,
You still have not responded to me on the 30 plus studies I have sent you. I am not a statistician as I stated and I never would be a person to critique or analyze a study. I leave that up to folks I consider experts.
You said, " The IARC mechanism for assigning members is "politically correct," not so much scientifically correct."
It seems that you are doubting that the IARC, the International Agency for Research on Cancer, is scientific. This is very concerning and clarifies your position for anyone reading.

MJ:

"I am not a statistician as I stated and I never would be a person to critique or analyze a study. I leave that up to folks I consider experts. "

1) One part of Lerchl's response -- which you were quick to ridicule -- requires understanding the mean of three numbers. Are you seriously telling us that you find this calculation beyond your abilities? This is middle school math.

2) Sage vs. EPRI is manageable by anyone with two semesters of college physics. Is this also beyond your ability?

Malaprop you said, "The only thing I can say about the three IARC members is that they sanctioned pseudoscience and shame on them."

Well Malaprop, Im afraid we cannot really debate much because the gulf between us is wide.

I think the IARC has grievously been too slow to deal with EMF issues and you think they are alarmist and pseudoscientists.....
its like an ocean dear friend, an ocean between us.

Let's back this up.

1) If Lerchl's comments were fabrications why hasn't Taylor responded?

2) What expert did you rely upon when you ridiculed Lerch's calculations?

3) What expert do you rely upon for Sage vs. EPRI?

Wow, You run away from everything I say and want to engage in a middle school math debate ?
Do really think this is a useful turn?
Can you do it will the thousands of studies I have sent you links to.
NO!
doubt it.
We are talking about the worlds major scientific bodies making statements. You are calling them "pseudoscientists". There is no reason for me stoop to your level and debate numbers in a mouse study where several other studios have confirmed the same study! However I will humor you. How about you bring your question to Tyler himself on Monday?
You have avoided my offer to meet and for you to ask yourself!
Talk about running away!
But I do think that it is not that you are running away but that you live quite far from the DC area and it would be quite a commute from whatever state you live in.

1. You compare the Council of Europe to Lindsey Lohan
2. You call the IARC "presudoscientists" more politically correct that scientifically correct....
3. You tell a man his service to the country will not matter if he engages in a debate
4. You ignore most every study or link I send .
5. You refuse to talk about ethics
6. You cant see how talking about ELF and its history of research is important to this debate
7. You do not see how looking at Telecom people who have committed crimes is important in this debate
8. You avoid all I send about the reams and reams of health effects from RF fields.
Enough said.

and 9. You refuse to ask this man whose numbers you are so caught up in - these burning middle school math questions you have- face to face!

Malaprop- its an ocean

Malaprop, your thoughts below are pure gems.
1. You compare the Council of Europe to Lindsey Lohan
False -- that is an insult to Lindsay Lohan's intelligence.

2. You call the IARC "presudoscientists" more politically correct that scientifically correct....
False -- I said that the three scientists endorsed pseudoscience.

3. You tell a man his service to the country will not matter if he engages in a debate
False -- I said his service is irrelevant to the debate.

4. You ignore most every study or link I send .
False -- you ignore EVERY response I make to your studies.

5. You refuse to talk about ethics
False -- you have none.

6. You cant see how talking about ELF and its history of research is important to this debate
TRUE!

7. You do not see how looking at Telecom people who have committed crimes is important in this debate
TRUE!

8. You avoid all I send about the reams and reams of health effects from RF fields.
You bombard me with studies about which you are clueless -- I read some and then respond, and you run away.

Enough said.
TRUE!

Malaprop you have still avoided answering a simple question. Are you getting paid to write these posts?

Malaprop,
The WHO is going to be doing another review soon- as is the EU. Will you honor their statements ? as those of science?

You are still running away from my Prop osition.

Malaprop you also avoided answering another simple question:

Is it fair to charge a person with a pace-maker or medical implant an opt out fee.

Yes or no?

http://www.emf-portal.de/overview/mp_epi.php?l=e&explode=0&tab=2#alle
a list of mobile phone and cancer studies

MJ

"Wow, You run away from everything I say and want to engage in a middle school math debate ? Do really think this is a useful turn? "

We will finish this discussion. You claimed Lerchl could not be trusted -- something which we can decide if we just discuss his very simple calculations.

Why do you keep avoiding this? It was from a study you posted and that I read.

The EPRI vs. Sage debate will show us who is lying and who is not. You seem to want to avoid that one as well.

Your insistence that we consider telecom criminals in this discussion is silly.

"You claimed Lerchl could not be trusted "
Well, he was kicked off the IARC for a conflict of interest with Telecom.. right? Was that it? hmmm something like that.....

It is you who who are running away from the opportunity of your life.. to meet him and ask him in person. In the end, studies are complicated undertakings and I cannot profess to understand the details except. the summary, where the authors explain what it all means. I do not do research on mice.

I would not be STUPID enough to try and debate the details of a study as you so desire.
However you avoid the point that I sent several studies about cognition, several of which duplicated the results of the last. So in fact it simply does not really matter if one has a grievous flaw as you propose.

That said... why no response on the WHO report?
Do you think it is biased?
Anyone on that panel you see as "alarmist"
Heck, Im alarmed.
I'm alarmed PEPCO thinks its OK to put a Meter on my home linked with Fires and radio frequency pulses.

Indeed, I am alarmed.
I'll be walking around the neighborhood today helping folks educate themselves and decide if they want to opt out.

directions here- http://marylandsmartmeterawareness.org/opt-out-news/option-to-defer-smart-meters/

Here is the IARC exclusion letter for Lerchl:

http://www.der-mast-muss-weg.de/pdf/WHO/Lerchl/df_bp_who-lerchl_iarc-26oct10_eng.pdf

Note this sentence:

"An IARC Monograph is an evaluation exercise that demand complete independence from all commercial interests and and from advocates who might be perceived as advancing a pre-conceived position."

That certainly raises issues about anyone who would sign Carpenters pseudoscience letter.

It is incomprehensible that Hardell would be on the committee given that he has long staked a position on this matter, served as a plaintiff's expert witness in an $800 million lawsuit, was an author of the BioInitiative Report and produced authored one of the papers critical to the IARC Working Committee decision.

So yes, there are many questions about the partiality of Robert Baan.

It sounds like you have some work to do Malaprop. Best you contact the IARC and tell them of your concerns.
That is what I would do.
Funny most folks calling the letter pseudoscience by the way- are the Utility Companies and their propagandist puppets.
I am pretty sure that docs wanting to keep their job would not sign a letter they did not feel 100% on.
All I need is a large enough group of doctors concerned... and I'm concerned.

Maybe I should just write Lindsey Lohan... It would be fun to get her take on all this.

Also you never responded to this issue of overbilling... pretty funny!
OOPs to PEPCO
http://marylandsmartmeterawareness.org/smart-meter-news/former-director-of-dc-psc-silver-spring-md-resident-shocked-by-pepco-bill-this-month-pepco-estimated-bill-at-double-bc-smart-meter-not-turned-on-yet/

And about this letter. I should point out the IARC points out that about half of his research papers are not even original research.. but in fact criticisms of studies that suggest a harmful effect from EMF radiation.
Juicy!
I would place bets that guy has money running under his table to do just that.- to discredit studies showing the harmful effects of Radio frequency radiation.
Him and you are brothers in the fight!
http://www.der-mast-muss-weg.de/pdf/WHO/Lerchl/df_bp_who-lerchl_iarc-26oct10_eng.pdf

He is a total puppet!
a consultant for the Telecom industry!
I would love to see his off shore accounts...
Juicy juicy tidbits from your super sleuthy investigations!

More pseudoscience from David Carpenter, BIR co-editor with pseudo-scientist Cindy Sage

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n7L21XOC2wA

notice Dr. Carpenter's impossible demand for negative prood at 0:47

"What is the evidence that smart meters are safe? ... and the answer is that there is no such evidence."

and here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KN7VetsCR2I

watch the gratuitous flask shaking 9:39 (probably under the direction of the biased reporter) when he claims that RF causes disease "and the evidence is strongest for cancer."

The biased media crew has Dr. Carpenter press some buttons at 13:29, followed by this quote remark:

"we have absolutely no evidence that it's safe."

Dr. Carpenter has a passion for making unscientific statements.

It seems to me that proving something safe before use, makes the most sense.... especially when the thing has proved toxic in other forms.

And thanks for pointing out that indeed the cancer thing.... has the strongest evidence.

You may be interested to know The Danish Cancer Society is reporting that the number of men diagnosed with glioblastoma —the most malignant type of brain cancer— has nearly doubled over the last ten years.
This data just released!
http://microwavenews.com/

MJ:

I post material questions on the validity of studies and you respond with speculation and innuendo because you do not understand statistics nor apparently basic physics. You follow with irrelevant financial issues which have nothing to do with the scientists I reference.

You are using a variant of the Gish Gallop debating style:

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Gish_Gallop

How about staying on topic and discussing the issues.

My personal story is that I have developed tinnitus, pretty bad in both ears. I assume not only from the cell phone but from these cordless phones I used most of my life and whose base I slept inches from.
We shall never know the exact cause and I can only hope it is the worse effects I get.
"Regularly using a mobile phone for at least four years seems to be associated with a doubling in the risk of developing chronic tinnitus .....The prevalence of chronic tinnitus is increasing, and is currently around 10 to 15% in the developed world, "

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/07/100719205636.htm

Whatever the cause.... I will eliminate this possible cause...
Seems prudent to me.

There are a total of 17 states that now have actions opposing the mandatory installation of Smart Meters.
Anyone interested can look here for details. http://marylandsmartmeterawareness.org/smart-meter-news/state-by-state-chart-of-actions-opposing-smart-meters-across-the-us/

Don't forget to take a look at this Malaprop, You forgot about it...but now that we are back to Cancer and physics
http://www.childhoodcancer2012.org.uk/slides/session7.3-henshaw.pdf

Childhood Cancer 2012 Conference presentation on EMF and Childhood Cancer.

Smartmeters emit this field.
"The International Agency for Research on Cancer (IARC), a component of the World Health Organization, has recently classified radiofrequency fields as “possibly carcinogenic to humans,” based on limited evidence from human studies, limited evidence from studies of radiofrequency energy and cancer in rodents, and weak mechanistic evidence (from studies of genotoxicity, effects on immune system function, gene and protein expression, cell signaling, oxidative stress, and apoptosis, along with studies of the possible effects of radiofrequency energy on the blood-brain barrier)."
http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/factsheet/Risk/cellphones